if
it's about Cardiff..
Sport, Entertainment, Transportation, Business,
Development Projects, Leisure, Eating, Drinking,
Nightlife, Shopping, Train Spotting! etc.. then we want it here!
Firstly simon you never once used the word opinion. Secondly you said I need to rethink my argument. This would indicate you are saying I am wrong. You even used the word argument which would indicate once again that you can't tell the difference between a statement of fact and an opinion.
Your thread is all over the place, just saying
My thread is all over the place, is it? I'm just pulling you up on statements like...
Jantra
I am also surprised that some on here have adopted the stance that those who don't benefit from a service should be made to pay for it.
By pointing out that there isn't really anyone who doesn't benefit from having a decent infrastructure of roads, rail, etc. I don't feel the necessity to put an "in my opinion" next to every point I'm trying to make, as you don't!
There you go again correcting my opinion. You are all for opinion but only if they agree with your view. You have done this several times now in this thread.
May I remind you this thread is about cycle lanes and additional provision. Why you think the motorist or pedestrian will benefit from extra cycle lanes is beyond me. New roads or paths I could understand. But we are discussing cycle lanes - lanes for cyclists. This is why the cyclist should pay for them as they are the only direct beneficiary. Everyone else benefits only marginally if at all.
As I said, people kick up a fuss about hs2 as they contribute taxes but get no bebefits but the very same people now want the cyclists equivalent of hs2 paid from the same general taxation. You couldn't make up this type of hypocrisy. You need to adopt a position and apply it logically to each situation and not pick and choose your application to suit.
There you go again correcting my opinion. You are all for opinion but only if they agree with your view. You have done this several times now in this thread.
May I remind you this thread is about cycle lanes and additional provision. Why you think the motorist or pedestrian will benefit from extra cycle lanes is beyond me. New roads or paths I could understand. But we are discussing cycle lanes - lanes for cyclists. This is why the cyclist should pay for them as they are the only direct beneficiary. Everyone else benefits only marginally if at all.
As I said, people kick up a fuss about hs2 as they contribute taxes but get no bebefits but the very same people now want the cyclists equivalent of hs2 paid from the same general taxation. You couldn't make up this type of hypocrisy. You need to adopt a position and apply it logically to each situation and not pick and choose your application to suit.
Hang on! What's this "You are all for opinion but only if they agree with your view" nonsense? What are you talking about now? I'm disagreeing with your opinion, while you're disagreeing with mine.
Do you know how much David Cameron announced as "The biggest ever single injection of cash for cycling schemes in England" was? Let me tell you, it was a mere £94m.
Incidentally, it was pure spin, since in 2008 the Lab govt. injected £140m. The point is, that both these are pitiful amounts.
Jantra, the point that I am (and I suspect others are) trying to get across is that improvements to cycling provision can be paid for out of general taxation just like all other forms of transport are. No part of taxation is ring-fenced to pay for any particular form of transport.
If more people cycle it will benefit motorists and hauliers as there will be less engine-powered traffic on the roads. There will be less congestion as cycling is partially grade-separated from the main road system and bikes don't take up much room on roads anyway.
It would be utterly impractical and a bureaucratic nightmare to tax/regulate cycling and very difficult to enforce the tax/regulations and any sanctions arising.
Cyclists (assuming they don't drive) pay tax in almost as many ways theoretically and in practice as anyone else, including VAT on their cycling-related purchases.
You are coming across as MASSIVELY SWIVEL-EYED on this subject mate.
There you go again correcting my opinion. You are all for opinion but only if they agree with your view. You have done this several times now in this thread.
May I remind you this thread is about cycle lanes and additional provision. Why you think the motorist or pedestrian will benefit from extra cycle lanes is beyond me. New roads or paths I could understand. But we are discussing cycle lanes - lanes for cyclists. This is why the cyclist should pay for them as they are the only direct beneficiary. Everyone else benefits only marginally if at all.
As I said, people kick up a fuss about hs2 as they contribute taxes but get no bebefits but the very same people now want the cyclists equivalent of hs2 paid from the same general taxation. You couldn't make up this type of hypocrisy. You need to adopt a position and apply it logically to each situation and not pick and choose your application to suit.
Hang on! What's this "You are all for opinion but only if they agree with your view" nonsense? What are you talking about now? I'm disagreeing with your opinion, while you're disagreeing with mine.
Do you know how much David Cameron announced as "The biggest ever single injection of cash for cycling schemes in England" was? Let me tell you, it was a mere £94m.
Incidentally, it was pure spin, since in 2008 the Lab govt. injected £140m. The point is, that both these are pitiful amounts.
I'm all for different opinions. all you need to do is show me where I have said yours is invalid or incorrect? you'll have a job as I have not said anything of the sort. you however have said I need to rethink my approach (or words to that affect). in other words, you think my opinion is flawed. it may well be but that doesn't mean it is wrong.
why are you arguing about funding? you'll find I agree with you. I've said repeatedly I'd like to see more cycle networks akin to northern europe. Perhaps you only read what you want to read and see what you want to see. All I have said is that additional cycle routes, lanes and network benefit cyclists more than anyone else and it would therefore seem reasonable to expect cyclists to pay for the lions share. this to me makes sense in the same way we should expect Birmingham/London/Manchester to pay for HS2.
Jantra, the point that I am (and I suspect others are) trying to get across is that improvements to cycling provision can be paid for out of general taxation just like all other forms of transport are. No part of taxation is ring-fenced to pay for any particular form of transport.
If more people cycle it will benefit motorists and hauliers as there will be less engine-powered traffic on the roads. There will be less congestion as cycling is partially grade-separated from the main road system and bikes don't take up much room on roads anyway.
It would be utterly impractical and a bureaucratic nightmare to tax/regulate cycling and very difficult to enforce the tax/regulations and any sanctions arising.
Cyclists (assuming they don't drive) pay tax in almost as many ways theoretically and in practice as anyone else, including VAT on their cycling-related purchases.
You are coming across as MASSIVELY SWIVEL-EYED on this subject mate.
abu Dai how you doing?
there is nothing to suggest the british will give up their love affair with the car if we have more cycle routes. nothing at all. the fact is most journeys are short journeys that could be undertaken on a bike but most prefer the dry warmth of their velocipede. I can't see less traffic on the roads as a result of an improved network. that is just wishful thinking. you only have to see the excuses trotted out when a new development is suggested with respect to increased traffic to see that most if not all think their car is a right not a luxury. for example, the morons of north cardiff and their protest at stopping much needed social housing in the brownfield llanishen reservoir often cited increased traffic. point proven.
I'll ignore the fact that you suggest the VAT on bikes is tax paid by the cyclist as well as the fact it is a tiny fraction paid in VED and fuel duty.
then you suggest that we should ignore infringements made by cyclists because it would be difficult to administer. that is of course bollocks. the UK is the worlds most bureaucratic place to live and we would find a way to manage the paperwork somehow.
the fact is you are a cyclist and you think you should be able to use the roads without adhering to the highway code whilst at the same time have a network of cycle lanes paid for by everyone but enjoyed by the few. saying that I'd personally pay for a cycle route directly from your house to seawall road and I'd paint a target on your arse for good measure
Jantra. How amusing that you think that I am Splott David from CCMB!? LOL!!!! you really are tilting at windmills! Think about the abusive, threatening message that you posted above. Not very nice was it? And you got the wrong guy! Is posting on forums actually making your life better?
You are coming across as angry, bitter, obsessed, compelled and slightly unhinged. I feel sorry for you BUT as long as you continue posting crap, I and many others will continue to engage with you. Some of your posts are intelligent, humorous and on-topic but unfortunately these posts are in the minority.
As Simon said, Cameron has promised £74 million for cycling in England. This is 1/1000th of the new estimated cost of HS2 alone. I reckon that £3 billion would give the UK an urban cycle network comparable to that of the Netherlands. We could have about 1000 km of grade-separated cycle lanes in urban areas for that money. All of the major cities could have their entire city centres covered by dedicated cycle lanes for that amount of money. Many people would abandon their cars in the flatter cities. IN MY OPINION that would be money well spent.
I never suggested you were splott david. I can't be bothered with the rest of your post as its inane drivel in your usual style save for that you want 32bn spent on cycles lanes that benefit you instead of 32bn spent on a train line that doesn't benefit you
I never suggested you were splott david. I can't be bothered with the rest of your post as its inane drivel in your usual style save for that you want 32bn spent on cycles lanes that benefit you instead of 32bn spent on a train line that doesn't benefit you
No. I suggested spending THREE billion pounds on cycle lanes. HS2 was costed at £80 billion by the Institute of Economic Affairs earlier this week, rather than the government's estimate of £42 billion. I've researched a little deeper and found that £3 billion would build 5000 km of dedicated cycle lanes.All UK towns and cities could have segregated cycle lanes throughout their centres and their arterial roads for that amount.
Why did you call me Abu Dai and refer to Llanishen reservoir if you didn't think I was your nemesis Splott David? I must admit it was interesting reading your spats with him on CCMB. He invariably got the better of you, too. I would imagine that many posters on this board enjoy the fun debates you have with Dr Tim, Archie, Mick, Cardiffi and of course SD. Ooh and Dyfroedd, Sludge and the rest of the gang on CCMB.
You are a hell of a lot more entertaining than Corrie or 'Enders.
Your problem is though, that we are laughing at you rather than with you.
I never suggested you were splott david. I can't be bothered with the rest of your post as its inane drivel in your usual style save for that you want 32bn spent on cycles lanes that benefit you instead of 32bn spent on a train line that doesn't benefit you
No. I suggested spending THREE billion pounds on cycle lanes. HS2 was costed at £80 billion by the Institute of Economic Affairs earlier this week, rather than the government's estimate of £42 billion. I've researched a little deeper and found that £3 billion would build 5000 km of dedicated cycle lanes.All UK towns and cities could have segregated cycle lanes throughout their centres and their arterial roads for that amount.
Why did you call me Abu Dai and refer to Llanishen reservoir if you didn't think I was your nemesis Splott David? I must admit it was interesting reading your spats with him on CCMB. He invariably got the better of you, too. I would imagine that many posters on this board enjoy the fun debates you have with Dr Tim, Archie, Mick, Cardiffi and of course SD. Ooh and Dyfroedd, Sludge and the rest of the gang on CCMB.
You are a hell of a lot more entertaining than Corrie or 'Enders.
Your problem is though, that we are laughing at you rather than with you.
I never suggested you were splott david. I can't be bothered with the rest of your post as its inane drivel in your usual style save for that you want 32bn spent on cycles lanes that benefit you instead of 32bn spent on a train line that doesn't benefit you
No. I suggested spending THREE billion pounds on cycle lanes. HS2 was costed at £80 billion by the Institute of Economic Affairs earlier this week, rather than the government's estimate of £42 billion. I've researched a little deeper and found that £3 billion would build 5000 km of dedicated cycle lanes.All UK towns and cities could have segregated cycle lanes throughout their centres and their arterial roads for that amount.
Why did you call me Abu Dai and refer to Llanishen reservoir if you didn't think I was your nemesis Splott David? I must admit it was interesting reading your spats with him on CCMB. He invariably got the better of you, too. I would imagine that many posters on this board enjoy the fun debates you have with Dr Tim, Archie, Mick, Cardiffi and of course SD. Ooh and Dyfroedd, Sludge and the rest of the gang on CCMB.
You are a hell of a lot more entertaining than Corrie or 'Enders.
Your problem is though, that we are laughing at you rather than with you.
I never suggested you were splott david. I can't be bothered with the rest of your post as its inane drivel in your usual style save for that you want 32bn spent on cycles lanes that benefit you instead of 32bn spent on a train line that doesn't benefit you
No. I suggested spending THREE billion pounds on cycle lanes. HS2 was costed at £80 billion by the Institute of Economic Affairs earlier this week, rather than the government's estimate of £42 billion. I've researched a little deeper and found that £3 billion would build 5000 km of dedicated cycle lanes.All UK towns and cities could have segregated cycle lanes throughout their centres and their arterial roads for that amount.
Why did you call me Abu Dai and refer to Llanishen reservoir if you didn't think I was your nemesis Splott David? I must admit it was interesting reading your spats with him on CCMB. He invariably got the better of you, too. I would imagine that many posters on this board enjoy the fun debates you have with Dr Tim, Archie, Mick, Cardiffi and of course SD. Ooh and Dyfroedd, Sludge and the rest of the gang on CCMB.
You are a hell of a lot more entertaining than Corrie or 'Enders.
Your problem is though, that we are laughing at you rather than with you.
gnasher's been on the cooking sherry again.
Who is gnasher?
Gnasher aka Abu david aka swampy aka rick Ross aka adolph eichman aka splott david. Turn it in, your posting style is like a spot on a domino
And don't flatter yourself that you're my nemesis. You're like the seagulls to my trawler
Jantra. I am not Splott David. You don't know who I am. I've never had any beef with you on CCMB. You remind me of Razz Prince, the regional manager in Phoneshop. Have you seen the car/dildo scene where he is shouting into the darkness?
That's you, that is!
I wasn't likening myself to Eric cantona ya daft plum
You are a legend in your own mind. And what a mind, mind. Like a finely-tuned Newcomen engine, clanking away.
You are right though. Would be vain and inane in the membrane to compare yourself to Cantona.
If I could think of a footballer that you are like I would take Bobby Robson's clarity of expression, Bryan Robson's sobriety, Vinny Jones' empathy, David Beckham's modesty and Gazza's sanity and combine these qualities into a Jantra-shaped bundle.
I wasn't likening myself to Eric cantona ya daft plum
You are a legend in your own mind. And what a mind, mind. Like a finely-tuned Newcomen engine, clanking away.
You are right though. Would be vain and inane in the membrane to compare yourself to Cantona.
If I could think of a footballer that you are like I would take Bobby Robson's clarity of expression, Bryan Robson's sobriety, Vinny Jones' empathy, David Beckham's modesty and Gazza's sanity and combine these qualities into a Jantra-shaped bundle.
He could be called Brybob Jones-Gaskham.
Or Jantra for short.
I'm glad I wore my corset as my sides are splitting
I wasn't likening myself to Eric cantona ya daft plum
You are a legend in your own mind. And what a mind, mind. Like a finely-tuned Newcomen engine, clanking away.
You are right though. Would be vain and inane in the membrane to compare yourself to Cantona.
If I could think of a footballer that you are like I would take Bobby Robson's clarity of expression, Bryan Robson's sobriety, Vinny Jones' empathy, David Beckham's modesty and Gazza's sanity and combine these qualities into a Jantra-shaped bundle.
He could be called Brybob Jones-Gaskham.
Or Jantra for short.
I'm glad I wore my corset as my sides are splitting
The lower half of Cathays Terrace has been altered to benefit cyclists. Wider cycle lanes and no line in the middle of the road, which makes people drive more slowly. What they need to do next is sort out the bridge over the train track, as well as the link between Cathays Terrace and Senghennydd Road, to improve the flow. I think I saw somewhere that the council are waiting on money associated with University buildings to pay for improvements to the bridge.
It's good news that cycling is up but it's still a piffling figure. Apparently just shy of 5,800 people in Cardiff cycle to work. I don't know if that means every day or most days or just occasionally.
By way of anecdotal evidence I've noticed much more people cycling. A few years ago I used to pass the same people so often that I was on nodding terms with quite a few of them. Now there seems to be a lot more although it still seems very much a minority pursuit. The figure needs to treble if it is to make a real difference - the more cyclists become a normal feature on the roads the more considerate motorists will be (especially if they are occasional cyclists), the safer cycling will be, the safer it is the more people will take it up, the more people out of their cars and on bikes the less congestion there will be etc etc creating a virtuous circle etc etc.
The 5,791 regularly cycling in Cardiff may be dwarfed by Bristol (a city with a notoriously awful public transport network remember) which in turn is dwarfed by the likes of Oxford, York and Cambridge, but it is almost as high as Birmingham (6,458), Nottingham (4,257), Sheffield (4,267), Liverpool (3,970), Newcastle (3,223)
Indeed, 3.6% of people regularly cycling to work in Cardiff, the city can lay claim as being one of the more significant cycling cities in the UK.
Bristol 7.5%
London 3.9%
Manchester 3.9%
Cardiff 3.6%
Nottingham 3.5%
Newcastle 2.7%
Liverpool 2.0%
Leeds 1.8%
Sheffield 1.7%
Birmingham 1.5%
Data is here: http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/publications/re-reference-tables.html?edition=tcm%3A77-353510
The fact that Cardiff is one of the UK's premier cycling cities with only 3.6% of people regularly cycling to work says it all. In the kingdom of the blind the one eyed man is king.
James,I reckon them there figures are really low. I always cycle into work so I'm totally pro cycling. I don't know what I was expecting, but it was probably something along the lines of 15% ?
I also remember being shocked when I heard how low the % of journeys into work by train was - IIRC it was also low single digits (although I can't remember if that was just Cardiff or Wales as a whole). Both appear to be effectively niche transport methods.
You are right James - it is moving in the right direction so for that we should be positive. It is frustrating that it is not moving in the right direction faster though.
I think that Cardiff has all the attributes to be a first class cycling city- it's pretty flat, compact and it has three river corridors that could be utilised for traffic free routes. Also most of the area between the Bay and the city centre is being rebuilt so incorporating proper cycling infrastructure will be easy.
The one downside is the weather - it is wet here which puts off a lot of potential cyclists.
I remember when the 20 mph test period was first announced the claim was that signs would be put up but there would be no roadworks to calm traffic. However, having past through Roath recently, it appears that there are quite extensive ongoing traffic calming road works in the area right now.
A bit of cash has been allocated to make Newport Road and City Road better for walking and cycling:
"Roads, public transport, walking and cycling routes in Wales are to have £15.4m worth of improvements... Junction improvements in Newport Road and City Road in will Cardiff receive £937,000,... The money is coming from the Welsh government's local transport fund to help deliver economic benefits and promote cycling and walking under the Active Travel Act 2013."
A bit of cash has been allocated to make Newport Road and City Road better for walking and cycling:
"Roads, public transport, walking and cycling routes in Wales are to have £15.4m worth of improvements... Junction improvements in Newport Road and City Road in will Cardiff receive £937,000,... The money is coming from the Welsh government's local transport fund to help deliver economic benefits and promote cycling and walking under the Active Travel Act 2013."
Is this money just for the previously planned City Road/Newport Road junction improvements? I don't think it will go far if it's for several junctions along City Road and Newport Road!
A bit of cash has been allocated to make Newport Road and City Road better for walking and cycling:
"Roads, public transport, walking and cycling routes in Wales are to have £15.4m worth of improvements... Junction improvements in Newport Road and City Road in will Cardiff receive £937,000,... The money is coming from the Welsh government's local transport fund to help deliver economic benefits and promote cycling and walking under the Active Travel Act 2013."
