Chris,

I would agree with your earlier post regarding Penryn Goldman's book To Hell and Gone. It is a very good read, bringing to life what a drive he must have undertaken. The car appears to be a late 20's Seven with an Australian built two seater body. I have the UK edition published in 1932 by Gollancz which has many illustrations and the Australian edition also published in 1932 by Angus and Robertson. There are no illustrations listed or present in my copy.

Location: oz

As someone with many interests, maybe reflecting my past profession of general practice, where I had to know a little about an awful lot of systems and parts of the body, I find most books on Austin 7s great to my level of interest. However, I agree that if you are writing an instructional manual, it has to be correct but still could prove a useful base for constructive criticism.

If every book could be studied and constructive views/criticisms were debated on the forum and then collated it would prove useful for future generations of owners. Despite its seemingly widespread criticisms I find the Source Book brilliant to show to anyone peripherally interested in A7s even if its just to show them how the first relatively affordable 'motor for the millions' started in the UK, the range of models built, the differences in style and the 7s influence on the start of other marques of car and even the rest of the World.

I hasten to add that I'm not volunteering for this not least because I'm neither a particularly skilled engineer nor that experienced despite many my nearly 50 years fiddling with 7s ! I've written to Chris regarding his 2 page list of criticisms and that looks to be a good start for such a project.

James

Location: Ferring West Sussex

The dangers of using one source of information, believing that anything in print in true, not asking questions and only hearing what you want to hear.

R,



Tony.

Location: Malvern, Melbourne, Australia

I have a good collection of prewar motoring travel books and will post a
Photo of the bookshelves, but can I recommend
Round The World in a Baby Austin"
By Hector Macquarrie.

In fact he went round in 2 Austins as the ship with his first Austin 7
Sank in the Pacific and he was rescued but not the 1st Baby!



He wrote several books including

"Me and the Baby" which I think is being reprinted in Oz.
I'd love to get a copy, even a modern reprint.

Watch out for the next post with over 100 motor travels by
Exceptional people including Girl Guide leaders who drove from Cape to Cairo
In a Bullnose Morris! Or the guy in " Half Safe" who drove round the world
In his small GPW US amphibious jeep, including crossing the Atlantic and the Pacific
!!!!!!! Surely the bravest man of the century?

Happy reading

Bill G

Location: Scotland

Hi here is a photo of some of my travel books
If you like armchair travel check out your second hand book shop
For some of these . Every type of car is covered!
On every continent.


Happy reading!

Bill G

Location: Scotland

Sorry Ian

I got my surnames of famous Scotsmen mixed!

And another aside which Bill will presumably not approve.
My grandmother had a collection of old weekly NZ mags which featured a centre section with large photos. As a boy I was especially fascinated by the remarkable photos of the Tahiti slowly sinking after its propeller departed and cut a hole in the stern. Photos of the crew bailing, passengers in lifeboats and the ship slowly going down in dead calm mid ocean. It seems Hector and his colleague took the photos and the proceeds from largely financed the replacement car. It was extensively overhauled by Austin in the UK... don’t know if a new crank was included!

Bob Culver

Location: Auckland, NZ

Hi all again, great post, raising lots of interesting issues. Bill regarding the title of the McQuarrie's book you mention it is 'We and The Baby' and a repro.is available form Ian Itter Publications in Australia along with other interesting tomes. Incredibly courageous journey when you consider the lack of roads or even tracks and having to float the car often in bits across raging rivers ! Consider the support from all the suppliers and possibly locals we have today and this and similar trips would still be very daunting !

With regard to Ruiairidh's last comment, I think he's right, everything said depends on the depth of knowledge and experience the person and often has to be taken with a 'pinch of salt' and can often amount to just an opinion rather than fact. The point I've been trying to get over is that any written word can form guidance to the complete novice, as I was at the age of 16, when I was faced with reassembling my first A7 from a pile of bits. James

Bill - your collection of travelogues interest me a great deal, I have some way to go yet.

James - my comment was is no way directed towards your statement, just a general observation of the way in which text, information and advice is treated by some.

I have learnt an awful lot through making mistakes over the years, perhaps more than any other method I have experienced.

Chris G - is there a reason your document listing the errors made by Williams cannot be shared here please? I would very much like a copy please.

Ruairidh, my level of paranoia hasn't reached the heights of this forum as I realise I'm a minnow sometimes swimming close to sharks of knowledge ! All I'd like to add is when you're on a tight budget as I certainly was when I started mistakes could prove expensive. The much missed Austin Seven Services at Kirby Wiske was virtually the only source of real help then.

When I dismantled anything to rebuild it, I photographed the parts all laid out in case I forgot how to put them back together but fortunately never had to get any of the films developed. Easy to do now with digital photography. Only years later did I learn from Messrs. Alec Mitchell and Tom Abernethy that the chassis had been bent when Ian Bell rolled the car going down a steep hill in Edinburgh...may have accounted for its subsequent poor handling !

Only now with really good Sevens can I really appreciate their worth.

James

Just managed to obtain a first edition of "Hell and Gone" cannot wait for it to arrive.
Until it was mentioned on this forum I was not aware of it.
Thanks chaps

Location: The Centre of the Universe

Bill Gardner

Hi here is a photo of some of my travel books
If you like armchair travel check out your second hand book shop
For some of these . Every type of car is covered!
On every continent.


Happy reading!

Bill G

Location: Oxfordshire

My favourite Austin 7 book is 'Austin Seven Competition History 1922 - 1939' by Canning Brown. I even have a spare copy for when I have worn the original out!
If you haven't got a copy, put it on your Christmas present list.
Another book I would recommend, albeit not Austin 7 related, is 'Rallies and Trials' by SCH Davis. Printed back in the 1950's, it is readily available secondhand.

Hi Chris

Thanks for the print of comments on Williams book.
It is quite different from my list!
Rather than all true errors, it is more soundly based elaboration.
Very apt comments on used diff adjustment.
And some debatable points. In practice, are wide RP brakes better than or same as narrow RN?

On the matter of general books, although not a true book, the Net account of journey from Mongolia to UK in a chummy a few years ago was a very good read.

Bob Culver

Location: Auckland, NZ

Bob, agree with your comments on the Bill Williams Book list of 'errors' although I've only looked through half of them and think they'd make a good supplement along with reference to suppliers and services in Austin 7 Owners Club (London) excellent Red Cross Directory as good original spares are becoming rarer and we can't afford them being subjected to amateur bodgers !

With regard to presumably the ebook account of the A7 trip from Mongolia to the UK in a Chummy, I've briefly trawled Amazon's Kindle and book sites in general but can't find a title .... can you provide more details ?
Cheers, James

"And some debatable points. In practice, are wide RP brakes better than or same as narrow RN?"

I know we should be wary of reading it in books - but I do remember reading in one of my text books that friction is independent of the area of contact!

Tony.

Location: Malvern, Melbourne, Australia

That's very true. All the increase in width does is reduce tendency to fade.

On the subject of Williams errors, we should remember that just because Bob Culver says its wrong, it doesn't mean that it is.

When I first started on Austin Sevens in 1960 Bill Williams book was the only source of information I had and very useful it was too!
I had a huge amount of help from the village garage who let me work on the car in the corner of their workshop and gave invaluable advice on replacing the broken crank.
Regrettably this type of local garage with knowledgeable mechanics willing to assist is now very rare. I think this forum goes some way to replacing them.

Location: Melrose, Roxburghshire

Hi James

The Mongolia journey was reprinted here from Octane mag in 2008 but author's name did not appear! Travelled with Annabel Jones and another car with Kip Waistell. Details were posted on a website now not apparently available. Hopefully others will provide info on where it can all be found.

Bob Culver

Location: Auckland, NZ

Thank you for passing these on Chris - the aforementioned sheets pertaining to Williams' erroneousness...

Another book is "The Little Car" by Leila Berg, with illustrations of A7 Box saloon by Gerald Rose. This is one of a series Puffin books aimed at "Young Readers" First published in 1955 and republished and reprinted since by Puffin. Delightful, especially for younger children (and anoraks) everywhere.

Location: Back from an Autumn Leaves run

Hi Bill and Bob,
Here is Hector MacQuarrie's account of the sinking of the Tahiti with the loss of their Austin Seven 'Emily'.
From Austin Magazine March 1931.






Bryan

Hi Bryan

Thanks for posting these pages, some of these photos
Are in the book.

Regards

Bill

Location: Scotland

The Mongolia journey by Austin 7 mentioned by Bob was actually called the Peking Paris. Ace VSCC navigator Annabel Jones crewed a Chummy with Sebastian Welsh.
I remember seeing Annabel on one of the VSCC Measham Rallies and she was saying that there were no maps available of Mongolia. It didn't seem to bother her, she would have to rely on her Geosat device!

The Blog of the journey is available HERE

I tried to borrow a copy of VAT 69 from the author but he only has a single copy left now. He did however say it was serialised in one of the A7 club mags some time back. Anyone remember or have digital copies?

I can help you with this Jon, Graham Rankin allowed me to publish the text and photos from VAT 69 when I was helping to publish the Association Magazines a few years back.

I used OCR software to capture the text and the pictures are digitised.

Jon,

I have uploaded the photos here: http://s123.photobucket.com/user/Ruairidhdunford/library/VAT%2069?sort=3&page=1

I need to locate the text files...

Hi Tony P

The friction rule taught from the sixth form is an empirical law, not absolute. There are many seeming anomalies ie slick tyres, lapped tapers... etc. Clutches often grip better with material removed. The exact response in any application is often not certain. Soft linings were considered very sensitive to temp; may degrade during a single stop, so the practical effect of width is indeed debatable.

Hi Alan

I have only documented four errors in Williams, none clearly on the recent long list, and one which you agreed with (vehemently).

My main concern is that despite other appropriate books now available, Williams is regularly recommended as the introductory text for Seven newcomers whatever their car. It tends to set them on the hot up trail which is not now so appropriate for many standard cars or their original cranks.


Re the Tahiti, the photo I particularly remember (from over 60 years ago!) was looking down on the crew in the hold filling the bucket. Our local inter island ferry recently lost its prop....

Newcomers looking for general info may find the post Books and Manuals useful.

Bob Culver

Location: Auckland, NZ

Mr Culver,

"The friction rule taught from the sixth form is an empirical law, not absolute. There are many seeming anomalies ie slick tyres, lapped tapers... etc. Clutches often grip better with material removed. The exact response in any application is often not certain."

Not sure about your memory and the sixth form but -

When you increase the surface area, pressure between the two contact surfaces decreases because
Pressure = Force/Area
Now, this decrease in pressure due to the force cancels out the increase in the frictional force thus developed on increasing the area.
Hence the frictional force becomes independent of area of contact surface.

Slick tyres and the coefficient of friction? Not sure about your reference to lapped tapers?

Tony.

Although not approved by some, thank goodness for asides on this Forum. Led, amongst other things, to the intriguing mention of Ruairidh’s class following the Mongolia chummy. It would be difficult to devise anything more likely to capture the imagination and interest of youngsters. (Some aspects, like the loss of the second tent, would even interest teenagers). Certainly beat following the fizzled Air Race, or vague travels of Marco Polo in my day.
If I thought I could have taught that sort of thing instead of maori hocus pocus I might have pursued teaching.

Bob Culver

Location: Auckland, NZ