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Stopping detail.

G'day all,
On the question of brakes, shoes & springs: As always, my interest is in early ('24) 6" brakes. Is there any preference as to which way around brake shoe pairs are installed? As the shoes and springs are different, does it matter which is leading & which is trailing? I assume that there is one shoe with the spring attachment "bars" and the other with just the holes in the shoe face for the spring, on each axle end.

As a matter of interest, does anyone know why this was done this way, with asymetrical return springs? Also should there be an access hole in the lining material for the one with the "hole"?

Thanks,
DG

Re: Stopping detail.

Are you not able to get any details from - pram hood @ ing in eur.co.uk - The Pram Hood Register?

Phil.

(Remove all spaces in addy)

Re: Stopping detail.

Hi Dennis,

As far as I am aware, there is no preference as to which way round the brake shoe pairs are installed, in fact I don't think that you have a choice - or do you have handed sets? I think mine are all the same.

There should be an access hole in the lining material so that you can pull the spring ends through. Make sure that the hook is the right size to be pulled through before you fit the shoes - sometimes they have to be ground down slightly. I think they were done this way so that you could remove and replace the brake shoes without dismantling the hubs. I certainly do it like this. It helps to have some stoutish wire doubled around the ends of the springs and pinched tight to hold them in place, then feed the ends through the holes and bend them over. Hold the brake shoes in position with rubber bands and then pull the spring ends through the holes in the shoes using pliers or similar. After a bit of practice it works quite well. Perhaps I ought to write up this procedure one day for the new Pram-Hood website (access via www.ingineur.co.uk/A7C). I recommend having the linings bonded on and continuing the ends of the linings on beyond the ends of the main shoe area. Don't bother with the middle two rivets, but do fit the end two. I also suggest getting the bonding people to leave the lining overlapping the edges of the shoe by 1/16" each side.

Hope this helps,
David

Re: Re: Stopping detail.

Thanks David,
I thought Phillip's reference would drag you in! Although the shoes I have are not specifically "handed", there is a choice, as half the shoes have round bars between the inner shoe webs and the other half have the matching holes in the face. The return springs have a radiased hook on one end, to go around the bars, and a sharper "tick" shape hook on the other end, to catch through the face hole. The springs are quite long, about 3 1/2" with the "coil" bit about 1" long in the middle. The hole size in the shoe face is much too small to pull the sharp hook end through and there were no matching holes in the existing linings. The hole in the lining would have to be quite large to allow clearance for the hook (at least double the shoe hole size). Unfortunately I have not found a definitive description on how all this goes together, even Woodrow doesn't go into that much detail. Bruce White published an installation tool tip similar to your description (http://www.austinseven.org.au/).

Thanks for the recomendadtion on the linings, which I plan to have bonded-on soonish (an expensive business for all shoes!).

Cheers & thanks, the restoration meanders on.
DG

Re: Re: Re: Stopping detail.

Dennis, David has mailed Jason to say he is unable to access this post with further help. I have tested and can find no fault?? So David, can you try again. ,also if you mail me direct,we can discuss the point you raised.Your e address is not on the post. Thanks . Mac

Re: Stopping detail.

Hi Dennis,

As you have surmised, the shoes come in pairs (one of each sort). The holes in the shoe face should be 1/4" so carefully drill up through these holes with a 1/4" drill to put a couple of neat holes in the lining. Grind the 'tick' on the end of the brake springs so that they will just pass through the holes. Carefully carve slot-s about 3/16" square beside the holes on the face of the lining, each slot facing towards the ends of the shoe. You may find that the spring ticks have worn grooves on the shoe by the holes; if you can fill these with braze and file them back it will help you to release the springs when you want to take the shoes off again.

David

Re: Stopping detail.

Mac,

Thanks for your posting which sort of solved the problem, because I tried replying to you, only to discover that I could preview my message with no problem. So I tried inserting the text of my original reply to Dennis (which I had saved) and by dint of a certain amount of fiddling discovered that it didn't like the plural of the word 'slot', which is why I've had to insert a hyphen in my reply. Really weird. Perhaps you or Jason could investigate this further?

Dennis & I have since been corresponding direct on this topic, with Phil Baildon contributing as well, so it's a pity that the idiosyncracies of the forum have prevented our priceless pearls of wisdom from reaching a wider audience!

David
pramhood@ingineur.co.uk

Re: Re: Stopping detail.

If I may make a late entry on the subject - David is of course correct in every detail, but what I've done in the past is this : Having decided that every tiny bit of braking area is vital, the holes reduce this capacity. So I've drilled the sides of the shoes and inserted a h/t pin, peened over each side, so that each end of shoe is the same. Sure you miss the convenience of not having to remove the hubs, but how often do you replace the linings anyway? One thing is certain, however way you attack the problem - have only bonded linings, never rivetted, get slightly oversize as David suggested, ensure the material is the softest you can obtain to give maximum braking. It will then take years to wear out if you learn that A stands not for Austin, but for Avoidance, which should always come before B for Braking, 'cos relying on 6" brakes to stop you isn't always a good idea ! Cheers, Bill

Re: Stopping detail.

Which brings us back to something I was told in the late 50's when learning to drive in a A7, you learn to hit the cheapest thing.

Many thanks to this topics replies, they have been very useful, even if I do have the later, wide shoes.

Sandy Croall