The water pump gland on my blown Ulster engine has begun to leak copiously, as opposed to the dribble it's displayed for years. As you probably know, the seal itself is a sort of grease soaked woven string (as in stern tube packing on boats) compressed by a threaded cup like a cycle bottom bracket cup that screws into the casting on the back of the water pump.
If the water pumpdrive shaft did not also pass through this cup into the timing case to become the magneto drive shaft, repair would be easy!

Perhaps a picture is worth a thousand words.
You can see the threaded cup with its castellated end partly unscrewed from the housing. I can probably just get it clear of the housing, but not far enough away to thread in more packing. If I'm lucky, there might be a gap of 1mm.
Of course I could take the engine out, dismantle the timing case and do it properly but has anyone got a good idea for a bodge to keep me going for a month or two?
Regards, Stuart

Stuart
The greased stuff for packing prop shaft glands on boats comes in different thicknesses. Maybe the thinnest which I think is around 1/8 could be persuaded into the gap.
I have found on my boat that putting some of the silicon grease one gets at the boat yard helps reduce the leak and that stuff definitely can be put in the gap

Hope this helps
Pat USA

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Stuart,

Possibly not practical, but brainstorming might lead somewhere more positive!

Would it be possible to make up a fibre washer, thickness 1mm, od as the threaded bush, id as the shaft. Split this along the diameter. If these halves were inserted (maybe two thick) would this compress the seal sufficiently to keep you going?

Shut up Mike that's absolute bollxxxx.

Well I tried

Mike

Thank you, Pat; will pay a call at the local ships chandlers.

Regards, Stuart

Stuart,
The water pump /mag drive is pig of a thing to erect even with the engine out,I would go along with Pat thinnest string feed it in and turn the engine over to wind it on .If you cant get proper thing try boiling string in water pump grease and use that.Tighten up the gland nut (LH thread) and use plenty of water pump grease thru the grease cap.I give the grease cap a half turn each time I use the car.

Sorry Stuart put my reply after Pats David

Thanks, chaps, this gives me hope! I had pondered on similar lines to Mike, but if I can wind in string at all it would be a good idea. Dave Dye tells me he uses an interesting engineered solution which needs the whole thing in bits, so I discarded that!
Very grateful to hear any more suggestions. Had thought about making a notch in the inside end of the threaded cup to help feed the string in, but can't bring myself to butcher it. Yet.

Regards, Stuart

Stuart

I've put a modern ceramic seal in mine (well I did make it from scratch so wasn't altering anything).

I'll email you the engineering drawing of the seal if you want. The downside for an original engine is that the shaft size is 12mm (it comes from the PSA parts bin).

Charles

Thank you, Charles. It's so long since I looked inside a water pump that I can't recall how the impeller is fixed to the shaft. It was in my mind to wonder if one could somehow fit a seal just behind the impeller (which could then be renewed from the impeller side of the pump relatively easily), perhaps making a cutter that rotated on the shaft to form some sort of seat. Dave Dye's objection to this idea was that the impeller is quite a long way from the nearest bearing so the shaft waves about a bit. He fits a third bearing in the original "stuffing box" to deal with this. Of course this means engine to bits.....would be interested to see a sketch of what you've done, will email you, thank you!

Regards, Stuart

I'm with Dave on problems of the the long and winding shaft.

Unburdened with original parts (either to mess up or to copy) I put a small ballrace in the water pump housing, followed by a lip seal and then the mechanical water pump seal. The idea being that oil from the timing case lubricated the ball race, the oil seal kept the residual oil in place and the mechanical seal keeps the coolant out.
The impeller is held onto my shaft with a small woodruff key and a locknut.

Charles

Thanks Charles, drawing received.
Engine no.1 is the one with the water leak but otherwise has no need to come down. Engine no.2 has to come apart to replace the blower drive shaft ball races, so I am also giving serious thought to pre-empting water pump problems while it's in bits.

Regards, Stuart

PS Pat, have just been to the boatyard to acquire some stern tube grease, so we shall see.
S.

David Howe wrote:

> I give the grease cap a half turn each time I use the car.

This always worries me. Where do the previous half-turns of grease end up? I assume in the cooling system (radiator)...

David

I suppose a small amount must do but cap is only half inch dia and have only filled it once in 1 1/2 years !!

I used to wonder this but, as David says, the amounts of grease are small and I don't think you would be able to push grease upstream into the water pump itself. Also, what little pressure there is in the system tends to push water out of the gland to atmosphere. I've never noted an oily film when I've drained the radiator.

Regards, Stuart

Like Stuart I have never noticed any sign of grease in the cooling water however a small amount does seem to exit via the gland nut,enough to dirty the tip of your finger.Also tightened the gland nut 1 notch in the last 18 months.You have to remember this is a LH thread.

Stuart,
I know I've come in late on this thread. I work in a power station and glands on pumps is something that we deal with. Ours tend to be much bigger, up to 3 or 4" diameter shafts but the priciple is the same. Ones that size are easier to get your hands and fingers round to work on as well!

Packing is string like but it should be a square section to fit into the stuffing box. For what this is you probably would get away with greasing some soft cotton based string. You could even try cutting some strips of Denso tape and evenly rolling them into a string. Packing is supposed to be cut into individual rings and fitted with the joints staggered. Wrap the packing around a round bar the same diameter as the shaft and cut segments axially with a Stanley knife. Push them into place but not too firmly, repeat until just short of where the follower enters the stuffing box. Leave it finger tight and all fairly loose. Run the engine and gradually tighten it up, packed glands are intended to leak a little, the water is the cooling. If you overtighten there'll be some smoke and you may damage the shaft. Add an extra ring if the follower goes right in.

It is part of this to gradually adjust it up - you could get away with just that at the moment?

If you don't like the drip of water on the drive a mechanical seal as others have suggested is the way to go. The downside is that they're fine until they let go - at least with a gland the leakage doesn't deteriorate fast - we've all probably experienced a water pump going on a more modern car?

Dave

Dave, thanks for your post, much appreciated. I did know that the "string rings" should be staggered like piston rings, but had not been bright enough to work out about rolling them round a bar.
There was about 1/16th of a turn of adjustment left on the follower, then it went up solid with a clunk. I think the inside of the stuffing box has a cone - like taper at its closed end . The tiny amount I was able to take up reduced the leak to acceptable proportions for about 100 miles, then we were off again!
Will have to have a go at this soon. Other concerns have kept me out of the shed for a week or two, eager to get back! Will report on progress in due course.

Regards, Stuart