While I'm ranting about the screen format in another thread I feel I must also write to the editor about the world map.

Dear Sirs,

Can I point to deficiencies in respect of our closest neighbouring country on your so called World Map.

Number one; the population of the republic of Ireland is about 4.5 million, the 6.5 Million figure would be for the whole island of Ireland.

Number two; the countries name is the Republic of Ireland or Rep. of Ireland for short, not Eire, as is used on the stamps and coins, We call Hungary, Hungary not Magyar!

Number three; having a box around the islands of Ireland and Britain and calling them both "the British Isles" would be the same for an Welsh person as referring to David Cameron as the English Prime Minister. (actually this one is true!)


Yours etc.
Mr G. Adams.

You betray your ignorance I fear. the islands are indeed the British Isles as so named by the romans. Great Britain refers to the bigger island and the other is lesser or minor Britain. However, this is unpalatable to our irish cousins!

However England, Scotland and Wales are countries in the island of
Great Britain.

This is why our country is called The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

So now the island of Ireland and the island of Great Britain are indeed the British Isles. It's a geographic fact. The Prime Minister of the United Kingdom is still the Prime Minister of Great Britain and northern Island.

When you refer to the population of land masses you add countries together. The population of Africa is all countries added together. So the population of Ireland is indeed the population of the republic of Ireland together with Northern Ireland. The population of Great Britain is England, Scotland and Wales. The sort of thing you learn in school - well, used to.

Wow Baywatcher that would be a good defence of my case!! but no I believe zach is quite correct that the ireland I refer to on the map ie the republic of, has a population of 4.5million - Which I've corrected. Correcting the name will take me longer so it's gonna have to wait. OK all well with the world for now? great stuff, enjoy the sun one and all!!

I'd be careful about accusing someone else of ignorance before checking your facts. Google is your friend.

Geographically speaking, the island of Ireland is in the British isles.
Just like Norway is in scandinavia or Portugal is in iberia.

The republic of Ireland is not politically part of the uk but it can't change its location because they find the name unpalatable.

Surely everyone knows, or at least should know, that the term "Great Britain" refers to the largest island in "The British Isles" which is a geographical term and not a political one, and thus includes the Island of Ireland.

i thought ireland was Hibernia and Great Britain Britannia. Ireland has never been known as lesser Britain, always as Ireland. Whether Great Britain and Ireland make up the British Isles really is moot. People will call it whatever they want depending on their own personal choice. Personally i'm not so insular as to base my lifes decisions on petty nationalism straight from the 19th century. not everyone has a modern outlook so I appreciate we are all different.

Charming!

So, let me understand this correctly, you're advocating that we call geographical (not even political) locations whatever we like, and don't settle on any standardisation? That would make a mockery of geography don't you think? Yeah - there's Hibernia and Britannia, and Cardiff is in Cambria I suppose? Carry on doing that if you wish, because I suppose those terms are standard, if pretty archaic, though some represent areas that now have different boundaries completely (Britannia was just the Roman occupied parts).

None of that negates the fact that the geographical group of islands is in fact called "The British Isles". That's the name that it's got - the group of islands that Ireland (Hibernia if you insist) and Great Britain, and several thousand other islands belong to.

And it's not insular and it's not based on nationalism. What part of "a geographical term and not a political one" did you misunderstand? Do you think that "British Columbia" is a political term too? Perhaps on some forum in Alberta there's an equivalent row where some Canuck Jantra is arguing the toss that it's not incorrect to refer to their neighbouring province by something else that it's correct title, say something made up like "Pacifica Province" or whatever they fancy because it's all OK "call it whatever they want depending on their own personal choice" (!)

Sorry Baywatcher, while Great Britain comprises of Wales, Scotland and England, lesser Britain is Brittany (Bretagne) and the term was probably initially adopted by Geoffrey of Monmouth.

In addition the Romans did not name the island they took and Latinised the name used by the inhabitants at that time. The Greeks in 600BC were aware of the island and the name used.

While the term British Isles is used in the context of Great Britain and Ireland there are some in the republic that find that offensive and do not use the term. For some it is too political.

Simon

chill. you misunderstand my point. The nationalist comment was aimed at the Irish who can't bring themselves to say their little green island is in the British Isles. Jeremy has already answred the question about grand bretange (Great Britain) and bretagne (Brittany), the island of Ireland has never been known as little Britain, lesser Britain or anything with the term Britain at all. It was Hibernia.

Whilst the term British Isles is correct, i doubt few if any use it in vernacular.

Q where are you from
A Cardiff
Q where is Cardiff
A the British Isles

really? I don't think so.

Thanks to everyone for correcting me! It's a pleasure to find out things I didn't know - shows the value of reading this forum.

And I apologise to Zack - I'm the one portraying my ignorance!

Well you don't say that, because you don't often want to refer to the group of islands in their entirity.

When you are referring to the group of islands, the british isles seems much less clumsy than "the northwest European archipelago".

why not? not everyone is governed by an arbitrary line on a map. I certainly don't get offended if I am called British, English or European. I doubt if many Irish get offended if their Island is referred to as part of the British Isles either.

agreed

to be honest, i'm not even sure of what my point is. i don't even know if I'm arguing or agreeing with you and Simon. I think its all a bit silly really. People will call it whatever they want and as long as the meaning is conveyed quite convincingly then it shouldn't be a problem. we have the UK, Britain, Great Britain all being coterminous with the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Technically speaking, the first two don't include Northern Ireland but when used in a political context they do!